Max users on TS2

[Bones_taw]

I'm wondering what the max users other clans have had on TS2 servers?

We are running TS2 on Symmetric DSL, 768Kbits up and down. Theoretically should support more than 100 peeps. Anybody run that many users on a server?
How about max users on 1 channel?

I'm just wondering, cause we had 60 or so on 1 channel and a lot of guys had problems when it should have been ok.

Any other limitations besides bandwidth?

Server is running Win2K w/ latest TS2. It is a mini-itx board w/ Via 800Mhz and 512MB ram.

[<Evil>Badger]

We have just started using TS and have found thatis superb as long as there are no more than 3 off us logged on.
Does anyone have any recommendations for the best configuration settings for client & server to improve this?:confused: :confused:

[guldi]

60 people in ONE channel with a SDLS 768 Link (which gives a HIGHLY THEORETICALLY bandwith of 96 Kbyte / sec) ??
*smile*... calculate:

if ONLY one of this user speaks: server has to send 59 * bandwith of codec:

CELP 5.2: 59 * 0.65 Kbyte/sec => 38.35 Kbyte => works
GSM 16.4: 59 * 2.05 Kbyte/sec => 120.95 Kbyte => no chance

if two speaks at the same time:

CELP 5.2: 59 * 2 * 0.65 Kbyte/sec => 76.7 Kbyte => should works
GSM 16.4: 59 * 2* 2.05 Kbyte/sec => 241.9 Kbyte => no chance

I guess on a server with 60 user in ONE channel, more then one or two people will usually speak at the same time.

Since the server does no mixing of voice streams, it uses VERY little CPU Time but lot of Bandwith with that amount of useres. I can't give you a hint how many useres the CPU can handle, but a common PC should be easily able to handle 60 useres (it's only a packet forwarding through the NIC, so really few CPU time is needed).

=> use low codecs !!!

@<Evil>Badger
=> Forum rules !!
with that crap of info you give, no tips are possible !

if you use a ISDN connection for the server or the highest codecs, I belive that only 3 people can stay on the server. Again, it is higly dependable of used codec and people speaking at the same time.

[<Evil>Badger]

"with that crap of info you give, no tips are possible "

Firstly with a response like that is no wonder that people give up on this & go back to RW.

I was asking if there are any 'general rules of thumb' when setting this up -

Info on the server is that it is connected via NTL cable so no problem with bandwith there......

Any polite suggestions how we get TS configured correctly would be great & if you need any more info, please ask

LOL
:)

[guldi]

still I have no glass ball so I can not guess your UP / DOWN bandwith for the server or client (maybe one client has a too small bandwith), the Codecs you are using, people speaking at the same time, the problem occuring (does only specific people have problems,...) and and and...

there are no best settings working for every configuration. You will have to set your Sound settings individually for every client since there are too many diff. Sound Cards, drivers,...

If you have a problem with more people joinig to the server and speaking, then it's usually a bandwith problem. I gave you hints how to calculat it.

I can't do more cause your info is still not complete !
so again, YOU are VERY general with your infos, so I give VERY general tips: bandwith !

[<Evil>Badger]

Thank you for your help.
I appreciate the problem with out more info but at present this is all I have as the server is handled by one of our other memebers.
You have confirmed my thoughts on each clients needing to make changes due to their own bandwiths.:p

[Susan Ivanova]

Originally posted by guldi
if ONLY one of this user speaks: server has to send 59 * bandwith of codec:

CELP 5.2: 59 * 0.65 Kbyte/sec => 38.35 Kbyte => works
GSM 16.4: 59 * 2.05 Kbyte/sec => 120.95 Kbyte => no chance

if two speaks at the same time:

CELP 5.2: 59 * 2 * 0.65 Kbyte/sec => 76.7 Kbyte => should works
GSM 16.4: 59 * 2* 2.05 Kbyte/sec => 241.9 Kbyte => no chance


WHOA! Wait a minute. You're saying that the server doesn't mux all audio-streams together into one stream and then sends out that stream to all connected players? Pretty inefficient if you ask me. I don't want to think about worst case scenarios like 10-20 people saying something at the same time.

[woutur]

We have discussed this matter more than once on these forums.
I won't go explaining it again but it ISN'T ineffecient if you look at it from a CPU cycles and latency point of view.

There are far more angles to this then you might think.

[guldi]

@<Evil>Badger

wait wait... I did NOT said each client MUST do bandwith changes. I said often each client has to set specific sound settings due to different HW and SW (drivers,...).

You can play with the Bandwith on the cient side, but if your client using cable or ADSL you should not get ito problems. However, the server has to set the codec carefully !

[Bones_taw]

Thanks for the info. It helps.
I didn't think about 2 people speaking at the same time doubling the bandwidth requirements. Also good to know that cpu is not expected to be a bottle neck. Although I do kinda wonder about the cpu on my server. The via processors are not known for performance. I have seen some benchmarks that show 800Mhz via performing like 300MHz intel.

We usually follow a protocol where people are supposed to "break" in before they talk. This cuts down on multiple people talking.

We have been using the CELP 5.2 codec, so it should support 60 easy w/ one person talking. We did seem to have some problems though.

Would running a moderated channel make any difference?

Would having some people record the channel make any difference?

What is the max peeps/channel you guys do for testing?

Has anyone out there run more than 50peeps on 1 channel?

[SatanClaus]

59*5.2/8 = 38.35 KB/sec
Problem is that as soon as 3 or 4 people shout "Break" at the same time, the server bandwidth will be exceeded. You should really concern making Squads in different sub-channels / main-channels and using the channel commander feature to communicate between the squads. (see the key-settings)


moderated channel could only make a difference, if you use it to ensure that only one person is talking at the same moment.

recording will only change the client's performance, never the server's.

What is the max peeps/channel you guys do for testing? ???? what does that mean?
max users (in the channel settings) means the max number of users in that channel.

there were much more people in one channel on public1, after a server reboot... but because half of them was yelling we had to moderate the channel.

cu
SatanClaus

[Bones_taw]

We do make use of a lot of channels. There are about 60 or so on the server. The reason we have 60+(could be as many as 100) peeps on a channel is for an all clan mtg.

Would it work better to have a few sub channels and have the speaker use the channel commander to talk to all of them?

More detail on my question regarding peeps/channel for testing: I'm wondering if you guys have a list of tests you do before releasing the next version of TS. In that list is there one regarding load testing with a large number of peeps on one channel. E.g. Test with 100 peeps on 1 channel.

[BlackConsult]

or u could just put in subchannels for max users

[Peter]

dsl just is very very very much to little for a *normal* usage with 60 guys in one channel...But, of course you could handle this if its not a game but a meeting, in the following way:
Make the channel moderated, and only let one guy have the rights to grant/revoke Voice, all others without any rights. If somebody wants to talk he hits Self->Voice-Request, and the Operator will give him (and only him) voice when his turn has come...after he has finished, the op takes voice off the guy, and gives voice to the next *voice*request*...Note the operator shouldnt talk, maybe he mute his mic :). But realy - a *real* server has at least 10 MBit line, and thats a situation you can host channels like this one on without having to restict this badly. :)

[Hellmutt]

We regularly have 50+ players in a channel and have had upwards of 150 users online at a time on a single server.

We found we could hold about 450 users at a time on a linux box with 256 MB of Ram and 800Mhz processor without much problem. We have an extremely fat pipe (OC-48c) but the big thing that seemed to be a problem is memory consumption of multiple servers. All the instances seems to hog up some memory.

Just a couple of weeks ago, I was on a "meeting" channel for a Planetside squad that had about 70 players on it at points with up to 4 or 5 people speaking over each other. The only people who had problems were the lower speed people on modem connections and even then they were mild and it performed much better then I expected.

My question is why do you need 60 people in a room? You might think of simply splitting the people up in sub channels to reduce the amount of bandwidth you use, you could also ask people to limit the bandwidth they use via the controls in Teamspeak client itself.

Of course this is all linux experience, so if you are running on windows your mileage may vary.. .